here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.
why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.
zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .
Thank you for your perspective Vidqun.
Then I said to them: “If it seems good to you, give me my wages; but if not, withhold them.” And they paid my wages, 30 pieces of silver. - Zech. 11: 12 NWT
I find the above verse clearly supportive of the the idea that the Messiah was God in the flesh just like the Apostles and the earliest church leaders believed, and wrote copiously about. Matthew 27: 10 applies a Messianic fulfilment to the 30 pieces of silver.
here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.
why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.
zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .
@Vidqun
WT has lied so much that I find it hard to read anything from them in support of their views.
There are actually two messianic prophecies in Zechariah which prove, unambiguously in my opinion, that the Messiah Jesus is God. The other one is in Zechariah 11:12-13, in which God says that 30 pieces of silver is the price at which God (me in this passage) was priced. In other words, this messianic prophecy is a prophecy about Jesus who is God.
Then there is Zechariah 12:10, which also unambiguously says that the Messiah/Jesus is God as well.
The best evidence for the traditional KJV rendering on Zech. 12: 10 comes from the original Hebrew which the Greek Septuagint is a translation of:
The fact is that the word "me" is in both the LXX and the original Hebrew.
The LXX has a few other problems as well. For the most part, the influence of the LXX on the NT is not a problem. We all rely on translations of the Bible today, and most of our English translations are quite good. However, translators can make mistakes. And this is seen in the LXX, as there are occasional mistranslations of the Hebrew Bible. For example, the book of Revelation cites the Greek Septuagint (LXX) of Psalm 2:9 three times (Revelation 2:27; 12:5; 19:15), saying that Jesus will “rule” the nations, whereas the Hebrew Masoretic Text (MT) says Jesus will “break” the nations.
i don't think it is possible to believe in jesus and then not believe what he said.
the purpose of the watchtower organization is to take as many people to hell as possible.
they do this by tricking people into rejecting the bare minimum requirements for the free gift of salvation that jesus offered to ”whosoever”.. one of the stipulations for salvation is belief that jesus was raised from the dead:.
@ Joey jojo,
slavery was all good
You said that, not Jesus.
here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.
why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.
zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .
no-zombie, here's my original question:
Why did Watchtower leave out the word "me" in Zech. 12:10 ?
i don't think it is possible to believe in jesus and then not believe what he said.
the purpose of the watchtower organization is to take as many people to hell as possible.
they do this by tricking people into rejecting the bare minimum requirements for the free gift of salvation that jesus offered to ”whosoever”.. one of the stipulations for salvation is belief that jesus was raised from the dead:.
A lot. Jesus is widely recognized as the most dramatic change agent in all of history. The whole world counts time by this mans life.
Jesus profoundly changed people’s understanding of love and forgiveness. His emphasis on unconditional love (agape) for all, including enemies, and teaching that forgiveness should be offered freely and repeatedly was a radical departure from the norm. This ethic continues to inspire social movements and conflict resolution efforts today.
Jesus elevated the status of women and children, who were often marginalized. He included women in his ministry, taught children as valuable members of the community, and challenged social norms regarding their treatment. This had a lasting impact on views of human dignity and rights.
Jesus’ teachings significantly influenced education, literacy, social justice and intellectual pursuits. The Christian emphasis on studying scripture promoted literacy. Christian institutions played a major role in preserving knowledge and establishing universities.
Jesus' self resurrection from the dead transformed views on death and the afterlife, reframing death as a transition to eternal life rather than a fearful end. This gave his followers courage in the face of persecution and continues to provide hope and purpose for many. His teachings on judgment based on how one treated “the least of these” have motivated ethical behavior and social responsibility.
i don't think it is possible to believe in jesus and then not believe what he said.
the purpose of the watchtower organization is to take as many people to hell as possible.
they do this by tricking people into rejecting the bare minimum requirements for the free gift of salvation that jesus offered to ”whosoever”.. one of the stipulations for salvation is belief that jesus was raised from the dead:.
Why didn't someone ask him about... the best possible diet that lets the average person live a long, healthy life?
I think because he didn't come to fix symptoms, He came to cure the disease.
the 2024 data from the jw website indicates that jw teachers have an over 96% failure rate with their students : .
2024 average bible studies each month: 7,480,146.
2024 baptisms:296,267. number of bible studies it takes to produce one baptism : 25.25. this means that jehovah's witnesses have an over 96% failure rate with people who want to study the bible with them.
I think that the reason why the WT still vigorously supports the d2d, cart work, "bible" studies in spite of staggering "failure" is because in their view its not failure at all. The program still effectively spreads the wicked idea to 7.5 million people per year (to people who might otherwise become Christian) that a person will wake up in paradise for a "do-over" after they die because they can atone for their own sin. No need for Jesus, or the bible study for that matter.
Of course Hebrews 9 : 27 says that there will be a judgment after a person dies. But a lot of bible studies probably decide to row their own boat after accepting the lies of JW "bible teachers" regarding "salvation".
here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.
why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.
zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .
@no-zombie
Many critics suggest that English translations of the Greek Septuagint might be biased to prevent a messianic interpretation.
However, the preposition “me” is definitely in the original Hebrew. If you are curious, you can go to http://biblehub.com/interlinear/zechariah/12-10.htm The literal translation of the Hebrew words goes something like this: “they have pierced whom on me and they shall look….”
I looked up the Septuagint translation of Zechariah 12:10. This is a helpful piece of data because the Septuagint translation was made before the ministry of Jesus. At this point, there was no strong reason for the Jews to have such a biased translation–geared to prevent a messianic interpretation.
The Septuagint translation has the one who is looked on also being the one who is "mocked" instead of "pierced", but the grammar is clear - "me".
here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.
why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.
zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .
Here's a Question for those who still support Watchtower on this forum. Why did Watchtower leave out the word "me" in Zech. 12:10 ?
Zechariah 12:10 reads like this:
And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me (Strong's H853) whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son - Zech. 12:10
Strong's H853
אֵת
Apparently contracted from H226 in the demonstrative sense of entity; properly self (but generally used to point out more definitely the object of a verb or preposition...)
Since the word "me" is clearly in the original Greek, why did Watchtower leave it out and translate this verse this way? :
I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the spirit of favor and supplication, and they will look to the one whom they pierced, and they will wail over him as they would wail over an only son - Zech. 12: 10 NWT
the 2024 data from the jw website indicates that jw teachers have an over 96% failure rate with their students : .
2024 average bible studies each month: 7,480,146.
2024 baptisms:296,267. number of bible studies it takes to produce one baptism : 25.25. this means that jehovah's witnesses have an over 96% failure rate with people who want to study the bible with them.
The 2024 data from the JW website indicates that JW teachers have an over 96% failure rate with their students :
2024 Average Bible Studies Each Month: 7,480,146
2024 Baptisms:296,267
Number of bible studies it takes to produce one baptism : 25.25
This means that Jehovah's Witnesses have an over 96% failure rate with people who want to study the bible with them.
Can anyone think of another "educational" system with a 96% graduation failure rate? Does this seem odd to anyone?
